Original Speed Bag useage.

[Speedbag]

Now this I have never seen before. One of our speed bag brothers ( note his techniques) doing something original

Speed Bag "wall" punching (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3-KtGFR6GA&NR)

and I thought this AB JAB (speed bag sit up board) (http://www.abc-of-fitness.com/shopitems/ab-trainers/ab-jab-ab-trainers.asp) was far fetched...

I'd love to here this without the music. Sparked my curiosity, that's for sure.

by the way, this guy is becoming very good.

Speed Bag Skunk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIb6Zh-YSo8)

[o0obruceleeo0o]

Maybe the "AB JAB" idea would work if you just had a really low set-up. Similar to how you had your recumbent exercise bike set up under the speedbag, but with a sit-up bench under it instead. I think that would be kind of cool actually.

[Teetu]

that wall punching is crazy! he's better at punching against the wall than I am from the platform!

i'm amazed at how fast & quiet that style swivel is compared to the ball & hook

[Speedbag]

Actually the bag on the sit up board [AB Jab] is exactly like a "Reflex Bag" (http://store.titleboxing.com/sbrb-u.html), which is fun to work with. Kind of related to a Double End Bag (http://store.titleboxing.com/double-end-bags1.html), except no strings attached. There is a definite rhythm to hitting it continously, you just don't have the "rebound" sound of a board, so you're fist contact and string bending is the sound. You can do a lot of the fist punches used on the speed bag with it, such as Front Double Punch, Front Fist Rolling. I've had one for a long time. Great for kicking, also.

I'm just not sure how the "AB JAB" (http://www.abc-of-fitness.com/shopitems/ab-trainers/ab-jab-ab-trainers.asp) connects to the board, for the picture doesn't show that.

* the guy hitting the bag on the wall has been working on the speed bag for over a year now, and takes it pretty seriously. His Seven Punches (Four front, Three Reverse,) and Elbow strikes are Smooth and Fast.

[Tim]

* the guy hitting the bag on the wall has been working on the speed bag for over a year now, and takes it pretty seriously. His Seven Punches (Four front, Three Reverse,) and Elbow strikes are Smooth and Fast.

He's very good... seems like he's picked up a lot in that time frame.

[Tim]

The ab jab in action:

http://www.blacklinesports.com/abjab.wvx

Looks like fun.

[Speedbag]

Great Link, Tim. I think I really like that little thing.

But geez, we have to start doing situps?? :o

[Chris M]

Here's a link to a site that actually shows what it looks like when someone's not on it: http://www.jumpusa.com/ab_jab.html

[o0obruceleeo0o]

I really want to try it after seeing the video. I wonder how staying up in the sit-up position differs from doing a bunch of sit-ups (as far as working out your abs go). Better? Worse? Anyone know about this kind of stuff? :)

[Speedbag]

o0obruceleeo0o, pausing in mid-sit up will put a lot of strain on the abs. Also, the swinging will strain them even more, for your balance changes as you reach out.

Again, you can easily simulate this on any similiar situp bench by "air punching" a similiar imaginary bag.

...and if you get one, remember, this is a rhythm bag, and you can do many of the same fist punching combinations that are possible on the Speed Bag -, Basic Rhythm, FDP, F-Roll, Hooks and some side punches. You will hear the spring flexing instead of a rebound board, but the principle of "triplet" or ODD number of springs (rebounds) is the same.

Maybe we should call them "springbounds" ??

[Dutchman]

Hi, I've been observing in the background for a while, and I thought I would forward some info on this subject. As some of you might know, exhibition bag punching was quite popular on the variety circuit for a good part of the last century. There were a number of acts where a man, or woman, demonstrated various techniques using one, or two striking bags, along with one or two mounted on the floor , like in this case on a wall. Some of these acts have put preserved on film. Gus Kellor was well known before WWI on the stage. In the late 1930's Doris DeGreen was documented on Paramount's "Unusal Occupations" short subjects in theaters. I recall a husband and wife team that had a striking bag act that did the TV variety show circuits in the early 1960's. Pretty much if they could rebound a bag off it they used it.

[SpeedBagSkunk]

i wasnt around then so i could have no idea about that i was simply hanging a new bag up when i found that when it was on its side it would do the same thing so i will not say i made it up but itsthe first time i have ever seen anyone do it. also i have another way i learnered and here it is. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWZB3_jEC20

[Dutchman]

Pull up British Pathe's site (www.britishpathe.com) and enter "punch ball" in the search field. There are a number of downloadable shorts of exhibition bag punchers as well as the boxing training clips. Also if you Google video Gus Keller there are a couple of clips that Edison did of his act. Note the size of the bags being used. They make the ones that are considered large now look tiny.

[SpeedBagSkunk]

cause i dont see them

[Dutchman]

You can download the preview clips for free, just fill out their form and then download them to your desktop

[Speedbag]

You can download the preview clips for free, just fill out their form and then download them to your desktop

you're right. I downloaded a few and there is some amazing footage. Especially the footage of Kid Brunnel in training to beat the world punch ball record. shot in 1941. Some amazing "floor bag" work. find it here for download Britishpathe.com (https://www.britishpathe.com//product_display.php?searchword=punch+ball&PHPSESSID=ce6a94512000d08f87ebb8fe6f5cf69a&start=21&rpp=20) It's free for a low resolution download.

As for Gus Keller, check this out.

Gus Keller punches bags, circa 1903 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyuF4b3NOyI)

As for Doris Degreen, Here is the listing from "unusual occupations 1940 video"

The first stop in this entry in the series is Woodbridge, New Jersey. Office secretary Doris DeGreen demonstrates her prowess with a punching bag, sometimes two punching bags simultaneously. She can keep them moving while blindfolded, while lying on her back, and can work one bag behind her using her elbows while working a second bag attached to the floor between her feet, using her lower legs

Here is a listing from and article or picture in Life Magazine December 4, 1939 (http://www.2neatmagazines.com/life/1939.html): (last sentence in listing)
...Doris DeGreen of Wood Ridge, New Jersey is world's best woman bag-puncher.

[Dutchman]

I've seen the "Unusual Occupations" episode. They were at one time shown as time fillers on American Movie Classics. Doris was very skilled at the bag(s), especially considering the size of them. They were "old school" about 14x18 I'd estimate. The film series is now owned by Sheilds Pictures Corp, and they are released only for broadcast and research purposes now. From what I understand there are no plans to release them to the home market.

[Speedbag]

I've seen the "Unusual Occupations" episode. They were at one time shown as time fillers on American Movie Classics. Doris was very skilled at the bag(s), especially considering the size of them. They were "old school" about 14x18 I'd estimate. The film series is now owned by Sheilds Pictures Corp, and they are released only for broadcast and research purposes now. From what I understand there are no plans to release them to the home market.

Rats. I'd love to see her hit. There is really some amazing footage out there of speed bag. I would have loved to been around in those days. You can't find bags that size. I just order a picture of the Vagges vaudeville bag punchers.

I'd love to pony up and get some of the video's off the britishpate.com site, as well as some of the stills. Especially of the kid brunnel video, but the british exchange rate is unreal. If my online monetary translater is correct, the minute or so video is almost $900.00.

and thanks, Dutchman, for your insights on the history. You've got a wealth of great information in that area. :)
your posts have really opened up a very colorful section concerning speed bag history.

I've noticed particularly that the Brits seem to really like the combo of the:
Outward Single Elbow STrike ' Front Straight Punch L-(OSES) ' R-(FSP). The FSP travels under the elbow strike. Brunnel does it a lot, as do some of the woman in the britshpate.com videos.

[k4moore]

Doris DeGreen is my grandmother, so I would be happy to relay stories of her time as a speed bag puncher. As stated previously, she was featured in Life Magazine, Popular Mechanics and a Paramount newsreel (in the Unusual Occupations series). The newsreel is available on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_03KIDtZv9U. She also toured the country on a vauldville-like circuit.

Punching a speed bag is not that hard, but doing it well and for any duration is challenging. Add the blindfold or multiple speed bags, and it is a real skill. But, she was able to still hit a bag proficiently into her 70's.

[Speedbag]

Doris DeGreen is my grandmother, so I would be happy to relay stories of her time as a speed bag puncher. As stated previously, she was featured in Life Magazine, Popular Mechanics and a Paramount newsreel (in the Unusual Occupations series). The newsreel is available on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_03KIDtZv9U. She also toured the country on a vauldville-like circuit.

Punching a speed bag is not that hard, but doing it well and for any duration is challenging. Add the blindfold or multiple speed bags, and it is a real skill. But, she was able to still hit a bag proficiently into her 70's.

WOW! I consider it a great honor to communicate with a direct relation to Doris Degreen. Although I have only seen the short clip of her on Youtube, and wish there was more footage or her speed bag work available, I consider her one of the early innovators for using and displaying the speed bag to others. The early days of modern speed bag equipment saw several unique and creative speed bag punchers, many were lost to antiquity due the limited media, but the article about Doris in the most major magazine of the Day, Life Magazine, december 1934 most likely took the speed bag to more people at one time than had ever seen it. I can't prove this, but I imagine that article and newsreel may have helped develop later equipment modifications as the popularity and demand for it grew largely because of the article and newsreel.

I purchased an original copy of the Dec 4 Life magazine just to get the article, and you can see those pages scanned by looking down this link (http://www.speedbagcentral.com/ssp/speedbag_history).

Perhaps you have some other insightful information you can share about her life, both speed bag and otherwise, with pictures that you may care to share with the group. You may be one of the only people we ever communicate with that actually stood under the board with her and personally witnessed her skill on the bag. Most of us know that seeing someone punching on video really pales to being next to them and experience their punching live. So, whatever you feel comfortable sharing would be respectfully appreciated. It is seldom we get to meet with such a close and direct descendant of a true speed bag legend, and your grandmother was all of that - at least in my eyes.

Welcome to the Forum! Your presence honors us all.

[ashe]

that looks bad for your posture skunk! :D

[k4moore]

Unfortunately, I do not have any additional videos of Doris DeGreen to share with the group. She did continue to hit a speed bag throughout her life and did teach me some. However, I never saw her hit more than one bag at a time. She taught me some basic patterns, but she did not continue hitting publically much after the Life Magazine article (instead she got married and raised a family). None of her children/grandchildren followed in her footsteps of performing (it is too early to tell if her great-grandchildren will).

A little background... her father was a professional wrestler sometime around the 1910's-20's. And then opened a gym in NJ. Doris started going to the gym with him (unusual for a girl at the time) and he taught her to hit the speed bag. I am not sure how it evolved from one bag to multiples. She bacame so good that she started being invited to club dinners to perform. This led to a tour which culminated in Billings, MT (as stated in Life Magazine).

I am still looking to find out more of the history, and unfortunately she passed away a few years ago, so we can not ask her. If anyone finds additional details, please share.

[Dutchman]

K4Moore, I seem to recall that she made an appearance on Letterman when he was on NBC, about twenty years ago. These shows are the property of NBC, perhaps a copy of the footage could be obtained.

[k4moore]

Dutchman, unfortunately, it may have been someone else on Letterman. My grandmother was no longer performing in public at that time. I would be very interested in seeing who it was on the Letterman show.

[ninja420]

HAHA k4moore is one of the few people who can tell folks....."My grandmother punches better than you do!" :)

[Dutchman]

Apparently after the first of the year Sheilds Pictures agreement with YOu Tube has expired and Retro Reel is no longer featured. While it's a shame that it's no longer viewable, for nearly a year new generations were able to see the mastery of the bag by Doris DeGreen.